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9/24/2013 7:57:20 AM

Indiana Puzzler
Indiana Puzzler
Posts: 559
This question seems less like a "Logic Problem" as demonstrated by Penny Press magazines and more like a Math Olympiad question. I read Ally's link on Yahoo! Answers and the response; the response posted enforces my opinion. Logic must be used, but it appears to be more of a math word problem rather than a "Logic Problem."

9/24/2013 12:52:34 PM

Purple Pisces
Purple Pisces
Posts: 878
With all due respect I'm beginning to wonder if cantsolve is indeed an adult. We haven't heard back from him since an answer/explanation was offered. If he does indeed have the book and the answers, why ask on here for the answers? Maybe cantsolve has just been busy and hasn't had time to post, but it has me wondering. Just the other day Amy offered help to a new solver needing help ASAP with a logic problem. No new posts from that poster since.

I hope I don't sound too harsh but I'm getting a little tired of these students trying to get us to do their homework for them. You know we try to be nice and give people the benefit of the doubt that they are who they say they are when we don't actually know. I can say I'm a supermodel, but that doesn't make it true LOL!! It's sad because it's these posters who ruin it for others who actually like puzzles and genuinely want some help. It makes me more cautious in wanting to help.
edited by Purple Pisces on 9/24/2013

9/24/2013 1:10:05 PM

Amy Lowenstein
Amy Lowenstein
Posts: 1599
According to the 2nd of cantsolve's posts, he's a married man, and according to the 3rd of his posts, there is an answer in his book -- but he doesn't say that the answer explains the thought process, how to solve, etc. If it wasn't by Penny or Dell, maybe it had a "non-explanatory answer" which just says, for example, "5 of them ate 6 donuts, 6 of them ate 7 donuts" or whatever, and maybe it just says "19 of them ate 6, 7, 8 or 9 donuts." So for all we know, the "answer" may not be much of an answer. But it is indeed strange that cantsolve doesn't post back and get back into the conversation.

--
Amy

9/24/2013 3:36:20 PM

Indiana Puzzler
Indiana Puzzler
Posts: 559
Perhaps if he posted the answer and then presented his solution to the problem it would "validate" his query and bio?

Every course I've taken (I have a Chemistry degree with many many units of math and science) has required you to show your work to obtain partial credit. The final solution's not worth a hill of beans if you can't show how you got there.

I'm sure Google takes these students right into the PP/Dell forum when they search for the answers to their homework. I think there is a ton of fraud being committed now in the age of interwebs.

However, if cantsolve works a crazy schedule or something everyone here would give him the benefit of the doubt, I think.

9/24/2013 5:21:38 PM

Frances
Frances
Posts: 697
It can be difficult not to get cynical or disheartened if we suspect a student might be trying to cheat, or that we may have been "taken". I made a snarky post in this thread on the 22nd, but deleted it when I felt embarrassed by my tone. At least cantsolve tried to work on the problem, showed his work, and was willing to discuss the difficulties. That was a positive thing in his favor, student or not, and totally honest or not. But I also get tired, Purple, of students coming here for a quick answer for their homework.

There's not much we can do when people just lie and there's no way to tell, but has others have said, try to give the benefit of the doubt. I think we can just keep doing what we have been in these posts that we're not sure about. Ask questions like: "What magazine is it from?" Of course it may still be printed on the bottom of the page they have, and might not even be Penny/Dell. "How far have you gotten?" This will show any good-faith attempts. "Where are you stuck?" Maybe someone can then give a little hint to help get over the obstacle, and hopefully allow whoever to continue the solve on their own. (This, of course, is also a good approach when helping even when we know it's not for school.) Except for those looking for the easy way out, there's always a (slim) chance we might get a convert into puzzledom.

By the way, in that link you posted, Purple, I wonder how that person who answered 2 years ago figured that "more than 9" was equal to exactly 10.

I have felt uneasy about this thread from the beginning, but this is better than my other post, so maybe it will help with my cynicism and suspicious nature.
edited by Frances on 9/24/2013

9/24/2013 5:35:20 PM

Indiana Puzzler
Indiana Puzzler
Posts: 559
I certainly think the forum would be an even better place to interact with other solvers if one tenth of the posters posted more than once. There's a poster that goes under the handle Gatton (had Francis Albert as his avatar) that joined last summer and made some nice posts and hasn't been back since.

Even the "Puzzle Detective" came in to promote his show and then disappeared.

That said, I enjoy the conversations between us regulars.
edited by Chris_INPUZZLER on 9/24/2013

9/24/2013 6:04:11 PM

Amy Lowenstein
Amy Lowenstein
Posts: 1599
Yes, it was fun watching the "Puzzle Detective" shows on the Internet, and I learned of one or two new types of puzzles that interested me, but I wished there had been more shows, and that they would have been easier for me to find. They kept coming up in any-old-order segments and it was hard for me to see them in order. Maybe I'm not savvy enough with the "search" button. I guess if Craig the Puzzle Detective ever adds to his shows, he'll let us know on this forum.

--
Amy

9/24/2013 6:38:05 PM

Purple Pisces
Purple Pisces
Posts: 878
I'm sorry if my above post was harsh and offended anyone. I wasn't directing the second part of my last post towards cantsolve. I just happened to choose this thread to vent my frustration about students looking for answers. I'm sure if cantsolve is an adult he understands how kids would come here looking for answers and the frustrations that come with that.

I should take a lesson from you Frances and ask a few more questions before making assumptions. smile

9/24/2013 7:14:02 PM

Frances
Frances
Posts: 697
Well, I for one didn't find your post harsh or offensive at all, Purple. I was trying to temper my own feelings. Like I said, I was suspicious (right or wrong) from the beginning. And I agreed with what you said. As soon as we get a "Does anyone have the answer for...." or "I need help fast!" type of post, I'm suspicious. We've had so many of these students coming here for the answer only it can be hard to find a balance in responding. Now that school has resumed, it kind of feels like the swallows returning to Capistrano! LOL!

9/25/2013 9:47:45 PM

Purple Pisces
Purple Pisces
Posts: 878
Thanks Frances!! smile

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